God’s Word for You
Daniel 8:13 The Holy One who Speaks
by Pastor Timothy Smith on Friday, December 5, 2025
13 Then I heard a holy one speaking, and another holy one said to the one who was speaking, “How long is the duration of the vision about the continual sacrifice, the rebellion that causes desolation, and the surrender of the sanctuary and of the army that will be trampled?”
This verse seems clear and not difficult to understand, but there are some questions we might ask. Two holy ones speak. “Holy ones” is a regular way of describing the Lord’s angels. “He came with myriads of holy ones from the south, from his mountain slopes” (Deuteronomy 33:2; cp. Job 15:15; Zechariah 14:5; 1 Thessalonians 3:13; Jude 1:14). It can also be a way of describing God’s believing people on earth, but this is not as frequent: “Surely it is you who love the people; all the holy ones are in your hand” (Deuteronomy 33:3). In this case, how are we to understand who these holy ones are?
1, Could they be two of God’s human believers? No. A man, even in a vision, would not be preaching or asking such a question about the vision.
2, Could they be two of God’s holy angels? This is the usual understanding of the verse. Peter says that angels desire to look into such things, spiritual meanings of the things that God says, that God shows in visions, and that God does in both the visible and invisible realms (1 Peter 1:12). This is the view of most commentaries, including Leupold (a Lutheran, p. 350) and our our People’s Bible by Professor Jeske (p. 157).
3, Could the holy one who was speaking, that is, the first one mentioned, be the Holy One who Speaks? This is the view of Professor Gerhard, a seventeenth century Lutheran scholar and dogmatician, and, earlier, the view of Nicholas Selnecker (1530-1592), one of the authors of our Confession, the Formula of Concord (1580). Gerhard identifies this holy one as the second Person of the Trinity (that is, Christ before he was incarnate). “In 2 Samuel 23:2 and Daniel 8:13 he is called ‘the Speaking One’ because he is the interpreter of his Father’s will” (“On the Person and Office of Christ”). He explains himself this way: “He is the Word—not the spoken or uttered word; nor the conceptual, internal, or implanted word, which befits the angels or the human mind but not God; nor is he the innate word of the same character as is our intellect in and of itself; but he is the essential, substantial, subsisting, and hypostatic Word, because ‘the Word was in the beginning with God’ (John 1:1).” He is called “the Word” not only with respect to his office but also to his person, not only outwardly but also inwardly, because “he came forth from the mind” through the eternal begetting of the Father (John 8:42, 16:28).
To continue this line of thought, that the first holy one is the Son of God, we also notice the care Daniel takes with the verbs, distinguishing the speaking of the first one from the “saying” (“he said”) of the second one. In the first case, we have preaching or continuous speaking, a participle in the piel stem (repeated later in the verse for the same holy one) showing either declarative or characteristic speech (no other piel use fits the context). The other holy one, surely an angel, “said” in the simple qal verb stem.
Of these, the second and third explanations are both good and trustworthy. Neither one conflicts with the verses that follow. In those verses, we will hear the voice of God the Father, and the angel Gabriel who will speak from verse 17 to the end of the chapter.
If we cannot identify for certain whether Christ is speaking or one of his angels, we have the comfort of knowing that no holy angel would or could ever say anything that would run contrary to the Word of God or anything spoken by Jesus our Savior. Therefore the words of the chapter are absolutely true. The question being asked by the holy angel of the speaking holy one is this: How long will all of this trouble last? The question is asked for the benefit of Daniel, and therefore it is for the benefit of the whole Christian church, since the answer was for the sake of the Jews of the exile. For Christians living many years later, this all points ahead to the time of the Antichrist, and therefore it still has significance for us as a warning and a comfort. The comfort is illustrated here in the dialogue between the holy ones. Mankind is always being watched, cared for, fought for, and even discussed, by God and his angels. “From his dwelling place he watches all who live on earth” (Psalm 33:14). We are never alone. God said, “It is not good for the man to be alone” (Genesis 2:18), and he gave the man a wife, and yet he also watches over the widow and does not forget anyone (Psalm 146:9). He gives us tasks to do, especially when others might think we are lonely, for the Lord knows well that “most are busied when they’re most alone,” and can give time to God’s service that others cannot afford. For Paul says first-hand, “An unmarried man is concerned about the Lord’s affairs—how he can please the Lord” (1 Corinthians 7:32). But for those who remain lonely, the Lord’s eyes are on them as well, and he knows what is in their hearts, and most especially their heartache. We are never forgotten; the Lord does not ever forget his people, but he keeps on helping us as he has always helped his people (Hebrews 6:10). He cares for those who trust in him.
In Christ,
Pastor Timothy Smith
Pastor Smith serves St. Paul’s Lutheran Church in New Ulm, Minnesota. To receive God’s Word for You via e-mail, please visit the St. Paul’s Lutheran Church website.